“For a long time, I studied different Black spiritual practices around the world. Many of us are Christians now, but a lot of us believe the world of the dead is side by side with the world of the living. And I’m sure you heard the story, right? About the preacher who brought his wife back?”

Ayanna nodded. She tried not to think of the story any longer. Last year, at the height of her depression, she had watched over and over clips of the wife being interviewed on At Home with Simone. The wife wore a frilly white dress and a vacant look. If you wanted to believe her, the look seemed to speak to her always seeing elsewhere now. If you didn’t want to believe her, the look seemed to be on the face of a liar trying to avoid eye contact. The wife spoke about dying, about being alone and elsewhere, and the joy she felt when suddenly her husband was there. It was interspersed with what felt like clear fundraising for their church.

“I grew up believing that might be possible,” Ayanna said. She reminded herself to be brave. If anyone was going to take it seriously, it would hopefully be this woman. “I might still believe it’s possible. Or at least I want to.”

“I take it you’ve had an experience with a ghost.” Professor Collins pulled out a notebook. “Can I take notes?” Then she laughed. “I love having a job where I can say ‘You’ve had an experience with a ghost.’ ”

“Sure.” Ayanna ignored the ghost question and barged on to what she wanted to speak about. “I was raised in, our faith had a bunch of different names, but in the Church of the Blue Doors. You might also know it as Pathsong.” Ayanna realized the professor didn’t mind her interjections about herself and, in fact, seemed to be relieved not to have to keep talking.