isn’t that a slap in the face to those who are good?”

But then I’m like, “That’s not our problem—worrying about whether or not other people are getting punished.”

PASTOR

I think that’s a very good answer, Jenny, I—

CONGREGANT

(Takes the mic in her hand.)

And then the guy, he asked me,

“What about someone like Hitler,

if there’s no hell,

then what about him.

Where does he go?”

That’s a real question—I’m asking for an answer.

PASTOR

…

CONGREGANT

…

PASTOR

…

CONGREGANT

…

PASTOR

so

now see

if all are saved through Christ

all

then so is Hitler, so must even he be
Hitler is in Heaven.

The thief on the cross next to Jesus is in Heaven,

Hitler is in Heaven,

and everyone in between,
and everyone who comes after.

CONGREGANT

see now, that’s hard to swallow, I think

PASTOR

if there is no Hell

CONGREGANT

can’t he just go nowhere?

PASTOR

But then you have to figure out where the line is,
how do you draw that line?

CONGREGANTT

but according to you, it sounds like God doesn’t even draw lines

PASTOR

no yeah I don’t think he does.

CONGREGANT

What you’re basically saying is that if someone were to
murder my son

PASTOR

yes

CONGREGANT

and the murderer dies

PASTOR

yes

CONGREGANT

then both my son and the murderer would be in Heaven together.

And me too, when I die, all three of us

like a like a big happy family

PASTOR

… yeah

that’s right.

But I mean …

think about it

wouldn’t that be Heaven—?

CONGREGANT

no

PASTOR

a place where everything that was awful about earth is gone,
where the wrong that one has done is washed away,

isn’t that Heaven?

Wouldn’t you want that too: no matter what you’ve done, it can all be washed away?

CONGREGANT

I can’t imagine it, that Heaven,

and if I can’t imagine it, I can’t believe it,
and if I can’t believe in Heaven,
then that makes me feel lonely
and scared.

PASTOR

… But

why?

CONGREGANT

Why what?

PASTOR

I just … I don’t understand

your need to—

please don’t take this the wrong way but

I don’t understand why Heaven should be imaginable.

I think I would be disappointed if Heaven
were something I could imagine,

because what I can imagine is pretty dull, it’s pretty uhhh

imaginable. I want the Heaven
that my mind cannot fathom,
that is better than what my human brain can handle.

I want a God who doesn’t think like a man,
who isn’t as small-minded as I am,
who is, in a way, unearthly and inhuman.

Because I’d be pretty scared and feel pretty lonely

if God were so

imaginable.

You see?

So my advice to you
is to be patient.

To sit with it.

To pray.

To have an open heart.

And the understanding

will come.

Okay?

CONGREGANT

Okay

PASTOR

Thank you, Jenny.

CONGREGANT

just

one other thing I don’t understand

PASTOR

mm-hm

CONGREGANT